“As the Format Turns” – Final Lists of NXD-XY, Flashfire Set Review, and Updated Decks

Discussion in 'UG Article Talk' started by Ruiner, Apr 23, 2014.

  1. Ruiner

    Ruiner Active Member

  2. Adam

    Adam Noice bruv, innit.

    Your take on Charizard is my favorite I've seen so far. As I read about the versions focused around Stoke/Flare Up, I kept thinking to myself "When is the last time a deck based around a flip attack was good?" I can't remember any. Vanilluxe was only marginally playable with a 90%+ chance of getting a desired flip outcome with Victini in play. That deck would keep attacking over and over (and push its luck), but still, each of your few Stoke/Flare Up attempts seem crucial and there is a 25% chance they won't work? No thanks. Throw in a need for M-Charizard-EX too and the concept seems really bad.

    A focus on the 150 damage attack looks smart to me.
    willcompere likes this.
  3. Professor_N

    Professor_N Well-Known Member

    A focus on the 150 damage attack is definitely the way to go, especially with all the damage boosting cards we have right now to hit magic numbers with relative ease.
  4. Ruiner

    Ruiner Active Member

    Yeah, I mean MAYBE I'm wrong but I am pretty sure the other Charizard is just awful. I can't say that pairing it with both Garbodor AND Raichu is the best build for it ( something more streamlined may be better ) but I am certainly more excited by it and feel like it covers a pretty wide portion of the metagame.

    I wonder if there is a functional build where you can try and go for a t1 attack with Charizard, maybe using Bikes and Flame Torch. The problem I see there is you waste a lot of space to try and go for a plan that is still unreliable and is still useless if you go first. I'd love to fit cards which let the damage cap hit 180 though.
  5. Professor_N

    Professor_N Well-Known Member

    I was running it with Muscle Band and Lasers without Virbank. It didn't really run very well, but I thought it was a decent concept for hitting 180.

    EDIT: I don't believe you had it written anywhere; what was your reasoning behind no Druddigon in Virizion/Genesect? I feel like it would be a nice addition, especially with that single DCE in your list.
    Last edited: Apr 23, 2014
  6. Ruiner

    Ruiner Active Member

    My reason behind a lack of Druddigon is two fold. One, we rely on Skyarrow for retreats, and Druddigon is fat and retreats for 2. Second, you aren't beating Rayboar even with it, and you beat Blastoise without it
    onlyinAMERICA and Floral like this.
  7. willcompere

    willcompere New Member

    What was your reasoning behind Pyroar/Archeops? The concept seems shaky because if you go 2nd with the deck you can be in big trouble with them getting a turn 2 garbodor or stoise. Also how consistent does it get set up? Why didnt you mention pyroar palkia with deoxys and friends? that seems to be a mroe consistent version that hits faster and is mroe consistent
  8. snscompt1

    snscompt1 The worst Mafia player ever.

    Really enjoyed the article, specifically what has already been said about Charizard EX.

    I also like the addition of DCE's to the Fairy Box list post Flashfire. Great work with article!
  9. Ruiner

    Ruiner Active Member

    Will: There are three types of decks at the moment. Decks that are 100% dead to a Pyroar ( you beat ) decks that run evolutions ( Blastoise/Rayboar, fringe deck ) and decks that are dead to Pyroar that are forced to run some counter measure.

    I absolutely feel the deck can race most basic decks trying to run a thin counter line. A majority of the best decks are dead to Pyroar and have to run cards to beat it, and Archeops should often come out first. If not, you can likely have some game against it anyways.

    Dedicated evolution decks are obviously your worst enemy, but most of them use evolutions as enablers for basic attackers. You can likely kill an Emboar, or even a lone Blastoise. Can you kill an unrestricted flow of them? Probably not. Blastoise one shots you, and Emboar eventually gets Delphox.

    I actually am not a fan of Palkia hit and run decks in general. Especially now that decks get Lysandre. Maybe I'm overestimating how played it will be, but I doubt it. I tested decks with Palkia hiding behind Suicunes and Trevenants and the deck just didn't perform well enough. Obviously Pyroar is a bit different, but look at it this way. You still beat a deck that can't kill a Pyroar. But you now lose to Blastoise, and Rayboar. Depends on what decks run to counter Pyroar for your "basic decks with answers" matchup too. I just know I've never liked the hit and run decks and I like them even less due to Lysandre.

    Let me also say this: If I didn't discuss a deck or combination, that doesn't necessarily mean I feel it is bad. There are a lot of ways to include Pyroar in decks, and a TON of ways to build Charizard decks. The set isn't even out yet and people have been focusing on the Regionals format. I haven't been able to start testing every configuration yet. I've focused on the ideas I've felt were most promising. The two "new" decks may not be the best uses of either feature cards. Testing has to start somewhere. The decks have both been pretty nice in testing thus far, but I can already tell you I am 100% sure the Archeops list is not the optimal 60 yet. It still performs well enough, but the numbers are not yet final.