[Japan] XY3 - "Rising Fist"

Discussion in 'Pokemon TCG News & Gossip' started by Googleplex, Mar 24, 2014.

  1. Otaku

    Otaku Well-Known Member

    Umm... haven't we learned our lesson about "tails fails" cards?

    When Super Scoop Up works, its amazingly potent; without the coin flip it would obviously be broken. The thing is, depending on the format, it alternates between obscurity as people ignore it so much they forget its even there to being a must run (at least for certain decks). With the heavy emphasis on 2HKOs in the format coupled with the amazing amount of Energy acceleration, I am very worried about Super Scoop Up returning.

    I mean, its not fun winning/losing due to coin flips; we know that already. XD

    Sad that Energy Switch is coming back; while it also was thought bad for some time before the right format came along to make it "good", its presence makes it too easy to bypass restrictions on other Energy acceleration. Like Super Scoop Up, the only reason it isn't a staple is deck space. Enhanced Hammer is at best an example of two wrongs not making a right; the more powerful Special Energy cards are still too good even with its existence; but older, tamer Special Energy cards that might be okay would probably be "bad" due to Enhanced Hammer.

    Full Heal exists again. I suppose in certain decks that might matter, though I am hard pressed to name any definitively. XD
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2014
  2. Mandalayon

    Mandalayon New Member

    Guess you'd have to ask Michael Pramawat, playing 8 flipping cards in his deck for US Nationals (if the list posted on the official page is accurate)... ;)

    Sure, it's all theorymon now as I haven't tested much with the new cards (assuming the next format will be PLS-on), but Fighting.dec seems extremely strong, and not being able to remove those strong energies unless playing Cobalion EX, I'm afraid it will be overwhelming for many decks. Lucario, Strong Energy, Muscle Band, Fighting Stadium... In a straight, speed-oriented list, odds aren't low that we'll see a combination of at least 3 of those in many games on T1, resulting in 70 damage on an EX. I was mainly hoping for Enhanced Hammer to limit the damage output of fighting decks. We'll see how players adapt and deck lists will look like, but right now I presume Mewtwo and DCEs are bound to stay in many decks.
  3. StormFront

    StormFront Active Member

    Was Focus Sash initially mistranslated? Because now it says, it only takes effect if the Pokemon it's attached to has full HP.
  4. Salamencetrainer34

    Salamencetrainer34 An ogre-achiever

    It was always like that. Even in the game if not mistaken.
  5. Otaku

    Otaku Well-Known Member

    Michael Pramawat designs cards for Pokémon? Since my entire point was that a coin flip rarely if ever properly balances out a card, especially "tails fails" effects. Edit: Just to be triple clear, unbalanced goes either way: from junk cards rarely played to staples because even when they fail, they are more than worth the risk for the times they succeed. ¬_¬

    I haven't tested at all, but the amount of testing required to be "scientific" is a lot more than any one player or small group of players can muster. I remember first hand a crushing, humiliating tournament where my pet theories were put to the test: I'd gotten at least a dozen games in with my deck, probably two or three... but it turns out that I had been getting lucky a disproportionate amount of the time and hadn't realized it. ^^' Individual match-ups for testing probably need to be in the double digits, with overall games played hitting three or four. @_@

    So what I am saying is I have a high tolerance for good Theorymon, which seems appropriate given how often I engage it in myself. XD

    Glad you clarified this; I agree its most likely though given the track record of past rotations (and the coming Extended Format) I would say the only option legitimately off the table is a "reverse" rotation that adds sets back in... since that has never happened and would just be silly. ;)

    You do know there are other options, yes? Crushing Hammer will remain legal, though that is a coin flip. Pretty sure there are at least a few other attackers that can remove (or move) Energy as well. Even if not, there is always the old fashioned, universal way of discarding Energy cards: KOing that Pokémon! That won't guarantee any of the new stuff is balanced, but it seemed a point worth making before we board the hype train. ;)

    As you yourself pointed out, Mewtwo-EX comes back with a probable OHKO in many builds. Second, T2 70 isn't impressive with that kind of set-up, or at least it is familiar. Compare and contrast Strong Energy (and its hypothetical usage) to the actual reality of decks relying on Double Colorless Energy. Do I think we'll see a crop of new Fighting decks? Absolutely. How many of them will become significantly competitive? I am betting at least one, probably two or three... at least significantly different ones; "variants" or different core strategies built around mostly similar lists counting as just "one" for these purposes.
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2014
  6. Drench

    Drench Active Member

    Still annoyed that Pokemon is revealing many enjoyable evolution deck possibilities, while rotating level and heavy ball.

    Big Basics or bust.
    OshaWaterBottle likes this.
  7. Mandalayon

    Mandalayon New Member

    Sorry, I thought you meant 'we' as the player base, not the card designers.

    aah... That reminds me of my Nationals last year...

    (...)


    The only other cards that come to mind would be Pinsir in NXD (which will be out) or Kyurem EX... We'll see how it turns out. Especially now that we know Landorus EX stays in the format.


    (...)
  8. Otaku

    Otaku Well-Known Member

    Discarding an Energy from the opponent's Active Pokémon isn't common, but its probably "uncommon" at best. I did a quick Pokepedia search (they haven't added XY: Flashfire yet), and subtracting out duplicates (because the card was reprinted) or ultra specific (...Psyduck that only can discard W Energy), there are 29 results. Most are pretty bad, of course, but then again Crushing Hammer is a card that either ends up being overpowered or a waste, and in this format I think its mostly the former. Who knows, maybe Team Flare Grunt will finally be justified?
  9. Salamencetrainer34

    Salamencetrainer34 An ogre-achiever

    IMO, if you discard their strong energy, you just give them landorus fuel
  10. thflame

    thflame Member

    Landorus specifies basic energy.
  11. Otaku

    Otaku Well-Known Member

    And even if it didn't, your opponent is still a card attachment behind. This kind of thing only matters when the end result is you being down a resource: in the current format its like using Enhanced Hammer against Thundurus-EX and N usage in general. The former is something you don't do if your opponent would benefit from said Energy being attached elsewhere or s/he has nothing else worth attaching in the discard pile; your opponent is benefits more from you being down a card than anything else. On the other hand if you're opponent needs the from-the-discard attachment for a Plasma Energy but because of you they have to waste it on that Double Colorless Energy they also need attached to Lugia-EX, you still at least might come out ahead... similar to how sometimes N can (regardless of exactly how many cards are drawn) leave either or both players with better/worse/similar hands after its used.