“The Big Three” – Top Decks to Prepare for at Winter Regionals 2014

Discussion in 'UG Article Talk' started by DylanBryan, Jan 7, 2014.

  1. DylanBryan

    DylanBryan New Member

  2. heero101086

    heero101086 New Member

    Not a mention of Blastoise? >> Mentions there are, but I mean... why isn't it The Big Four?
    Even though it's second on the Top Cuts list of things winning at Cities?
    Also, I know that Blastoise took a huge majority of the Cities here in Ontario, Canada.
  3. Crawdaunt

    Crawdaunt Active Member

    Solid overview of the decks and interesting to see another player's take on the lists.

    Just curious. Looks like maybe a line of text was accidentally deleted. What did you mean here?
  4. LSabin

    LSabin New Member

    I think he means in relation to the Pokemon Catcher errata, IE you can happily sit Emerald Slashing away powering up Genesect with no danger of having your Genesect catchered and blown out by a Black Ballista? The grammar is kind of awkward hence it reading funny but I think that's what the author is getting at :).

    I also find it odd there was no mention of Stoise in this article, I feel it's more prominent in the format than Darkrai/Garb is. Certainly in the UK meta anyway (which I understand this isn't analysing but still). And as stated by the user above it posted very solid results on The Top Cut's cities top 4 analysis, with a good 30-40 more top 4's then Darkrai/Garb did.

    Great read all in all! Thanks
  5. DylanBryan

    DylanBryan New Member

    I'll try and answer everybody at once since everybody is asking the same question since I should have made it more clear why I don't consider Blastoise to be one of the bigger threats after Cities-I acknowledge that Blastoise has more top 4's then Darkrai/Garbodor based on the results that were reported. At the beginning of Cities Blastoise made Top 8 more than Darkrai/Garbodor even at my cities. However, after watching live streams of cities, talking with some players in other areas, and playing in cities the past two weekends it seems that Blastoise has began to fall off.

    I think the biggest reason for this is that Blastoise doesn't have many positive matchups. It can beat Hydreigon and straight Darkrai, but those two decks aren't having much success. If you tech enough Tool Scrappers then the Darkrai/Garbodor matchup becomes slightly unfavorable to even, if you play a Zekrom the Empoleon matchup is roughly even, the Plasma matchup is roughly even, the Emboar matchup is even, and the Tool drop matchup is even. That makes Blastoise seem like a decent play.

    However, the Virizion/Genesect matchup is really an uphill battle for Blastoise. Most of the Virizion Genesect player will Emerald Slash and power up at least 2 Genesect EX's on the bench while the Blastoise player tries to set up Blastoise as quickly as possible in order to use Black Kyurem EX. When catcher was not a coin flip, the matchup was closer because the Blastoise player could catcher up the Genesect EX with Energy and use Black Ballista if they got a fast enough start. Now, the matchup is more difficult because the Blastoise player cannot reliably Black Ballista Genesect EX and instead must Black Ballista Virizion EX. The Virizion/Genesect player can then Red Signal Blastoise and possibly play an N in order to put the Blastoise player in a difficult spot. From my experience the Blastoise player needs to draw very well in order to beat Virizion/Genesect, or the Blastoise player needs to play a couple of Pokemon Catcher and get lucky with an early Black Ballista + Catcher play on Genesect EX. The matchup isn't an autoloss but it's an uphill battle for Blastoise.

    Gothitelle might be a non-factor in some area, but if you play against it you're going to lose with Blastoise most of the time. The matchup is much worse for Blastoise than it once was because when you finally Deluge enough Water Energy onto Keldeo EX and Secret Sword a Gothitelle, you will be knocked out by a Silver Bangle'd Accelgor. Then you will slowly run out of Energy because you are unable to use Superior Energy Retrieval. If Gothitelle comes out before Blastoise then the game is a blowout and the Gothitelle player nearly always wins.

    Gothitelle is certainly not that popular, but Virizion/Genesect certainly is. I don't see why anybody would want to go into Regionals with a deck that is 50/50 with most of the metagame, but loses to a popular deck. A lot of games simply come down to how fast the Blastoise player can set up, which seems like a very hit or miss strategy if you're trying to Top Cut Regionals. I think some of the appeal with Blastoise comes from the fact that if you hit a Turn 2 Blastoise with Secret Sword/Black Ballista you can't lose. Although this puts you in a dominant position, I have beaten a Tun 2 Secret Sword going 2nd with both Darkrai/Garbodor and Plasma during Cities.

    If Blastoise is dominating your local metagame then you should prepare for it at Regionals and maybe even play Virizion/Genesect to counter it. However, any deck that you play has at least an even matchup against Blastoise. If you have had a lot of success with Blastoise during Cities and in testing then play it for Winter Regionals. Blastoise is still a strong contender and has the potential to win in the right hands, but I just don't think it's the biggest threat right now since it has mostly even matchups and loses to Virizion/Genesect.
  6. JayHornung

    JayHornung Active Member

    Really good article and great discussion on the 3 biggest decks going into Regionals. I also really like the write ups as they were sweet and to the point. I just would have really liked to see your personel lists instead of "sample lists" or "starting lists", especially since you said you played some of these at cities.
  7. Willyazaa

    Willyazaa New Member

    If you're worried about Yeti when playing darkrai garb, silver mirror + dowsing and 2-1 crushing/enhanced is all you need. Makes that matchup very favorable if you know what you're doing.
  8. DylanBryan

    DylanBryan New Member

    Jay- Thanks Jay! I don't really have a "personal list" for these decks. My Darkrai/Garbodor list was different at every Cities I played at. Some days I would play Double Keldeo because I was worried about Gothitelle. Most of the time I would drop to 1 Sableye/no hammers because Plasma was not winning events in my area to add things like a 3rd catcher, an 11th Dark, and a consistency card. Blastoise started to fall out of favor in my area so I opted to drop Frozen City in Plasma to make room for Pokemon Catcher and Hypnotoxic Laser for better matchups against the rest of the field. I'm not sure if I would recommend this approach for Regionals since it's going to be a diverse metagame and you have to be prepared for everything. I never played Virizion because I don't own most of the cards for the deck. Maybe in the future I could right mini-cities reports and how my deck developed from Cities to Cities. Thanks for the suggestion!

    Willyazaa-I agree that silver mirror, dowsing machine, and enhanced hammer are a very good option if you're concerned about Plasma. The only issue is that you will be at a disadvantage if you are facing a Darkrai/Garbodor with Gold Potion and Eviolites. I think it really just comes down to how much you're willing to sacrifice one matchup for another, which depends a lot on the metagame.
  9. DrMime

    DrMime Grand Poo-Bah

    Great article, Dylan! I enjoyed reading it, but it also made me a little sad. My Juniors son is really really committed to playing Empoleon, and in testing, Empoleon really doesn't have good matchups against any of these three decks. And when we tech it against one of the three--say Flareon for Virgen, or Silver Mirrors for Yeti, or Stunfisk/Bangles for Garbodor--it just seems to make the other two even less winnable. When I saw your title, I harbored a secret hope that you wouldn't be writing about these three, but oh well.

    Good luck to you at Regionals!
  10. DylanBryan

    DylanBryan New Member

    DrMime- I think just playing a couple of Max Potion or Flareon are enough to win the Virizion/Genesect matchup. I would run this since it takes the least amount of space. I would then try and make Darkrai/Garbodor or Yeti close to 50/50 and take a bad matchup to the one you choose not to prepare for. This way you son's Empoleon will beat Blastoise and Virizion/Genesect, have a 50/50 matchup, and a bad matchup. Unfortunately as you said it's not possible to prepare for every matchup.
    Good luck to you and your son at Regionals!
    DrMime likes this.