The Only Tool I Need is a Hammer!

Discussion in 'UG Article Talk' started by Crawdaunt, Dec 27, 2012.

  1. Crawdaunt

    Crawdaunt Active Member

    This is the thread for discussing the following article:

    The Only Tool I Need is a Hammer!

    Post your comments and questions below! Any and all honest feedback is much appreciated.
  2. TechnoLegend

    TechnoLegend Active Member

    +1 Crawdaunt amazing article, even with all the similar deck lists it was very easy to follow and keep track of all the changes you made and the reasoning behind each. I love how you explained your supporter choices for a deck with Gold Potion needing a Random Receiver, and the different supporter counts for a list focused on Computer Search.

    Computer search is an amazing card, with no draw backs everyone knows that, but Gold Potion is just to good not to use. In decks that include DCE i think Computer Search is best because its the only thing that can search it out. But i have found a hight count of Skyla and 4 of what ever i need, to work just fine without Comp search, leaving Gold potion open to use. Gold potion is nice when you dont get the best set up and somethingl ike Landorus is hitting into you, same with a Mewtwo. negating 90 damage from a 100 damage mewtwo attack is awesome, and game changing.

    There were a few more changes from your Original City's Article list to list 1 besides just switching the counts of Sableye DEX and Darkrai EX and removing an Ultra Ball for a Max potion. -1 Switch +1 Darkclaw, and -1 Random Receiver +1 Bianca were the other changes i saw. And its true that even a 1 or 2 card switch is a huge difference.

    I like the idea of having a Switch in Hammertime becuase of how important attack/junk hunting timing has to be in certain match ups, but i see how tight each of your lists are.

    My question to you is, in your Terrakion/Landorus teched version of Hammertime, when exactly do i drop down that terrakion? is it better to drop it quickly, and make them play around it, or try and go with the retaliate suprise drop when the opportunity arises? I know that every situation is different but, it helps to have a game plan.

    Also, what are your thoughts on a Super Rod or Revive inclusion in the teched versions of the deck, Super rod seems like it might be nice in alowing you to more easily discard for lands judgment late game. i know normally super rod is horrible in a dark patch engine deck. And a single revive could be very useful to reuse a Terrakion NVI or a Mewtwo EX that were either knocked out or you were forced to discard for some reason?

    Thank you agian for allowing me to second guess my deck choice. LOL There really are a lot of strong viable decks in this format, all with very different attackers and strategys.
    Adam likes this.
  3. Crawdaunt

    Crawdaunt Active Member

    TechnoLegend Thanks! Ah yes. My original Cities list was a shot-in-the-dark sort of list, so I didn't pay it much attention. I did have a Switch in there! If I were interested in having an out to Paralysis, I would most definitely use Keldeo > Switch in this metagame.

    That's a situational question. I mean, for the most part Terrakion is there to just Retaliate (and Land Crush the next turn if they don't deal with it). But if you haven't shown Terrakion (or fighting energy) yet, then I'd obviously keep it in hand. If they have no conceivable way of OHKO'ing it, then you could drop it early to prevent it from being discarded or N'd back, but ideally I'd have a Dark energy on it as well to make sure it can't become a catcher-stall target. If you could get a Dark and Fighting on it, even better.

    Super Rod? Not necessary. If I were running a straight Darkrai/Landorus sort of list, then I'd be running more energy to get the multiple Land's Judgements. As it stands, 30 snipe is often all you'll need for Landorus to do what it needs to. Hammerhead is Landorus' greatest asset in the deck. Land's Judgement is just a nice bonus to have against Hydreigon or Darkrai (and by extension other EX's). Revive is a card I don't dislike, but I don't feel it to be too detrimental to drop a Landorus or Terrakion early. If you're going to use Landorus, you can probably just drop him ASAP and get Hammerhead'ing. And dropping Terrakion early isn't the end of the world. Like I said, I just would want to be sure it's not going to become a stall target.

    And IMHO, though I really like Hammertime, I am looking to other options for my play for Regionals. It is nonetheless a top consideration and definitely a deck to know about. But I have found in my time together with the deck that it's just not my preferred playstyle (give me my Vileplume UD back!).
    Parenting101 likes this.
  4. TechnoLegend

    TechnoLegend Active Member

    Thank you for your detailed response! I think this article really breaks down the deck, giving me insight to what a very refined Hammertime list would look like and what techs are most likely included, when i face the deck in a serious tournament. But its really not my preferred playstyle either.
    I really cant stand cards you have to flip a damn coin to use, i feel like i look prety lame playing 2 crushing hammer a turn, or 2 SSU and flipping tails both times. feels like such a waste of space, i would much rather know the outcome of each card, knowing the limits of each card i chose to include in my final deck list and the reason behind it. I also hate winning/loseing because of the outcome of a flip. Dosent really feel like a win to me.
    Parenting101 likes this.
  5. Parenting101

    Parenting101 Active Member

    Great article Crawdaunt . Like you said, there wasn't much overlap between the similar articles. I agree with what TechnoLegend said, I really liked your explanation of your Supporter/Random Receiver choices.

    Are you swimming over to the mainland for Cities on January 5th? If so, I will see you then.
  6. Medziddo

    Medziddo Member

    Hammertime article! Just what I need, since it might just be one of my big choices for any nearby Premier Event. Thanks alot for a timely read.

    I've given it a thorough perusal and have a few questions.

    To confirm:

    The list with the best Landorus/Mewtwo matchups with List #3 (without the techs), correct?

    The list with the best Swiss game in an unpredictable meta is List #2 (with the techs), generally... correct?

    Sorry for the weird questions and thanks for confirming what I have perceived.
  7. Crawdaunt

    Crawdaunt Active Member

    Well, obviously playstyle is the most important choice for a player. But in terms of consistency and speed, #2 does that better and should likely do better in swiss thanks to that consistent pressure. But list #3 can afford to lose a game since it's got more of an end-game, which does better overall in the best of 3. And teching the builds helps your coverage overall, which should work better in a diverse metagame. But if you're confident you won't have to face lots of sudden Terrakion+Retaliates, then a pure build can deal with Landorus just fine thanks to Potion, hammers and efficient sniping.
  8. Medziddo

    Medziddo Member

    Thanks for the prompt and comprehensive answer!
  9. jbcheshire

    jbcheshire Member

    Great article with good reasoning for teching, which is what separates the good players from the average players..
  10. jennchannpkmn

    jennchannpkmn New Member

    What do you think of the 4 N, 4 Juniper, 2 Bianca, 3 Random Receiver version? I didn't see you cover it in your article and I think it can be a very fast variation of Hammertime.
  11. Crawdaunt

    Crawdaunt Active Member

    I'm guessing you're running Computer Search? I think the concept is fast, but I also think you get screwed over by N pretty quick. When your deck only runs 10 total supporters, an N can not just kill your hand, but you can also get a couple Receivers that nets you the supporters you don't want. You can probably tell I'm not a fan or Random Receiver in a deck like this, partially because you don't get to choose what you're using.

    IMO, Bianca does a good enough job in this deck that you don't need to try and focus on only using Juniper/N. But I wouldn't fault you for running the deck with 3 RR. Really... I just want to be sure I don't have to N my opponent when I don't want to. Especially if I could instead save N's for late game if I start rocky.
  12. Vysekun

    Vysekun The Ninetales and the Grapes

    I intend on running something close to list two this weekend with Keldeo EX.

    I worry about Landorus and I worry about getting paralyze locked.

    Hm. Any last minute retrospective advice?
  13. Crawdaunt

    Crawdaunt Active Member

    I'd say that my advice for Landorus would be to use hammers, and Potions, and 2HKO through their Eviolite through Dark Claw. It's pretty basic advice, but that's because I wouldn't really worry about Landorus too much. Terrakion is the problem in terms of Fighting weakness. And I guess my question to you would be what are you worried about that's going to paralyze you? Tynamos? Deinos? Accelgor? Overall I don't see paralysis being big enough in todays metagame to bother teching for it (which is why I never bothered to tech Keldeo in my lists). I also don't see Keldeo helping much against Landorus.

    Admittedly I'm a little confused about your asking for retrospective advice, haha. But I guess that would have been my advice entering the weekend. So how'd it go!?
  14. Vysekun

    Vysekun The Ninetales and the Grapes

    I say retrospective because cities is only just starting in Australia. I have a week left to test.

    I think you're right about just focussing on the energy denial vs landorus. I worry about tynamos/raikou ex with victini, but, I guess I should expect those players who played rayeels before to want to migrate to landorus.
  15. Crawdaunt

    Crawdaunt Active Member

    Ah... makes sense. Well... If you're really worried about Landorus a 3rd Potion in list #2 will make their life that much harder. And I wouldn't really worry about paralysis heading into the format. That sort of thing is very much a local metagame call. What I can say is that I was worried about paralysis entering our first week of Cities, and realized my fear was unfounded.
    Vysekun likes this.
  16. Vysekun

    Vysekun The Ninetales and the Grapes

    I think this is a fair point. At my regionals, there were two good players running rayeels and only one of them went the victini setup route. And I dont expect this player to want to run it again.

    Atm im running 4 sableye and 3 darkrai. Is this unwise?
  17. Crawdaunt

    Crawdaunt Active Member

    Yes (IMO). Though my first list ran 4 Sableye 3 Darkrai, it really needs to be the opposite. The problem is that when one Darkrai is prized, you only get 2. Which means you charge up one, and begin charging up another. Once you charge up the second, your first is KO'd. If you haven't drawn the prized Darkrai, you're left reeling.

    The other thing is that 4 Darkrai means you can retreat to an undamaged one and Energy Switch one or two energies to it to make more efficient use of your total energy. And if they catcher the damaged Darkrai, then you've got a fresh fully charged one to contend with. It also makes drawing into them easier.
    Vysekun likes this.
  18. Vysekun

    Vysekun The Ninetales and the Grapes

    Ok. But I want to be greedy and run 4 Sableye as well. Haha.
  19. Crawdaunt

    Crawdaunt Active Member

    Nothing wrong with that. I personally find another card is a better use of space than 4 Sableye, but it's nice to have the 4th against Sigilyph and for that slight extra chance of T1 Computer Search + Junk Hunt.
  20. Vysekun

    Vysekun The Ninetales and the Grapes

    This being said. Energy switch + ultra ball shoulf be enough.

    Idk if I should be scared of quad sig or not. But I dont want to tech against it at the cost of strength in other matchups.

    The difficult part now is finding another FA darkrai lololol.

    Edit:

    I want to fit 1 Mewtwo.

    What do you think of 3 sableye, 3 Darkrai and 1 Mewtwo? Too greedy?