Tier 1 Virizion EX, Genesect EX

Discussion in 'Competitive Deck Discussion' started by Serperior, Aug 14, 2013.

  1. baby_mario

    baby_mario Doesn't even care

    Let's be real here.

    There is no alt attacker for this deck that is any more than mediocre.

    Tropius is ok vs Suicune and you could make use of Return, but is that really what you want to be doing on T1? I think not.

    Bouffalant is also decent, but doesn't work especially well against non-EX Pokemon like Suicune. It's attack costs 3 Energy. Does it really make the deck that much better?

    Either Drifblim . . . eh, they're not bad, but they are Stage 1s, the Basic has a Retreat cost of 2. They help a bit against Plasma, but not much else.

    Virizion/Genesect has a very good set up Pokemon and a very good main attacker. It also has G Booster. The deck doesn't need something else to attack with that is almost always worse than Genesect, it needs to keep Energy on the Field for repeated G Booster/Megalo Cannon. That is why the loss of E Switch hurts the deck so badly. Fix that issue and you have a top tier deck.
    911donkey, SamSoldier and JR_nathan like this.
  2. infernaperocks

    infernaperocks A Proud Member Of Team Rouge!

    yes by cities i think this deck will perform much better.
  3. SamSoldier

    SamSoldier Don't know what to put here D:

    So, this is a very basic list that I would like suggestions. The aim is to get a t1 Emerald Slash almost all the time.
    2 - Enhaced Hammer are for plasma and hydreigon.
    2 - Tool Scrapper are for Darkrai/Garbodor

    Pokemons - 7
    4 - Virizion Ex
    3 - Genesect Ex

    Supporters - 16
    4 - Juniper
    4 - N
    4 - Skyla
    2 - Bianca
    2 - Shadow Triad

    Itens - 25
    4 - Colress Machine
    4 - Team Plasma Badge
    4 - Ultra Ball
    1 - Team Plasma Ball
    3 - Pokemon Catcher
    3 - Skyarrow Bridge
    2 - Tool Scrapper
    2 - Enhaced Hammer
    1 - Super Rod
    1 - G-Booster

    Energy - 12
    8 - Grass
    4 - Plasma
  4. yoyos

    yoyos delicious hot potatos

    So I spent the last week testing, mainly consistency on getting the deck up and running as fast as possible, turn by turn, in any situation.

    3 virizion EX
    3 genesect EX
    3 deoxys EX
    1 absol/tropius? (I like the absol testing)

    4 plasma
    3 prism
    7 grass energy

    4 N
    4 juniper
    2 Bianca
    4 skyla
    2 shadow triad
    3 frozen city (optional)
    2 plasma ball
    3 colress machine
    3 plasma badge
    2 super rod
    2 switch
    2 tool scrapper
    2 float stone
    1 g-booster

    I spent more time looking for staples in running the deck engine then running techs to suit the counter.
    Turn 1 emerald slash is 6/10, I'm working on a 7-8/10 ratio, I think it's very possible (I should note , I have an obsession with turning things into speed builds).
    Last edited: Sep 8, 2013
  5. indercarnive

    indercarnive Well-Known Member

    if you can get a t1 emerald slash 60 percent of the time you are lucky. people did the math, and its more like 10% with 4 badges.
  6. SamSoldier

    SamSoldier Don't know what to put here D:

    With 4 badges, 4 Colress machine, 4 Skyla, 4 Ultra Ball and 3 Skyarrow, I think it will be much easier to get the T1 emerald slash than 10% of the time =P
    blazechomp1 and infernaperocks like this.
  7. baby_mario

    baby_mario Doesn't even care

    Without some kind of maths behind it, these are just guesses. 10% doesn't sound too far off, considering you need

    Grass Energy
    Colress Machine
    Plasma Badge
    Skyarrow (if not Virizion start).

    That's a 5-6 card combo. Seems about as likely as a T1 Night Spear was last format.
    Googleplex, Ziggmiceter and Monferno like this.
  8. GreenPepper

    GreenPepper Badly addicted to League of Legends

    But T2 Emerald Slash is easier to achieve than T2 Night Spear was.
  9. baby_mario

    baby_mario Doesn't even care

    Just saying that, without any kind of stats to back it up, is meaningless.
  10. GreenPepper

    GreenPepper Badly addicted to League of Legends


    To get T2 Emerald slash, you need:
    Virizion EX
    Grass Energy
    Genesect EX (to attach to)

    To get T2 Night spear, you need:
    Any active pokemon
    Benched Darkrai EX
    Dark energy
    A means of discarding a dark energy
    Dark Patch
    Another Dark energy
    Energy Switch.

    And, if your opponent has Snorlax active, you need a catcher and your opponent must have a non-Snorlax pokemon on the bench. Also, if your opponent goes first and gets T2 Garbodor, you need Tool Scrapper.

    Which one seems more likely?
  11. baby_mario

    baby_mario Doesn't even care

    Ok, first of all the Snorlax scenario is a complete red herring: deck was played for about 5 minutes by about 10 people, so let's ignore it.

    It may seem like a 5-6 card combo is earier than a 7 card, but is it really?

    Means of discarding Dark? Juniper, Ultra Ball, CPU Search will do it. I fancy the odds of having one of those in hand beats your chances of drawing into Badge and Machine.

    Dark Energy? Deck played around 11-12. Not something you only have 4 of like Machine or Badge.

    You also had a strong chance of a Sableye start which helped things considerably (allowing you to discard the required Trainers T1 for draw/search and re-use them).

    I would need to see serious and complicated maths before I believed the T2 Genesect was more likely.
    911donkey and SamSoldier like this.
  12. KPiplup

    KPiplup An Imposter

    Gonna be quite honest, Junk Hunt makes running the precise math impossible.

    Purely in theory, with both you need a T1 energy drop. Both then need, at best, a T2 energy drop and one item card (Colress Machine or Dark Patch). Both need a route out of active, albeit Genesect doesn't *always* need a way out. In Genesect's case a SAB will work nicely, while Darkrai needs either a second Patch (to free up that T2 attachment) or a Float Stone.

    Essentially, the difference is minuscule if anything.
    Ziggmiceter likes this.
  13. baby_mario

    baby_mario Doesn't even care

    Which is what I said in the first place.

    I don't believe that building for T2 Cannon is the way to go anyway.
  14. Slowbro

    Slowbro is excited for next season

    T2 Night Spear is more devastating than T2 Emerald Slash is.
  15. SamSoldier

    SamSoldier Don't know what to put here D:

    I honestely think that the T1 Emerald Slash is a bit easier than the T1 Night spear last format, but it is a fair comparison =P
  16. yoyos

    yoyos delicious hot potatos

    6/10 is a turn ratio, so every 6 in 10 turn 1 I draw for t1 virizion, 60%-80% would probably be my down turn on not drawing into the start. However I found, 4 colress machine, badge, and skyla to be over kill from testing, and somehow slows down the deck from initializing a turn 1 virizion, and then hemorrhaging you're deck later down the line, even if you had the ultra ball and juniper in hand you would end up discarding the 1 of something you don't need to discard for something you do need, later killing the decks consistency. I need more testing to verify a few things.
  17. Brochacho01

    Brochacho01 Not even caring

    Hello! So my list tries to use emerald slash turn 2, and is very similar to the list that henry prior ran at the klacynzki open. One difference from his is that I do not run tropical beach. Also since the list runs lugia EX, it doesn't benefit from skyarrow bridge, so instead I run 4 float stone and 1 switch. I also run 1 Deoxys EX to help out with certain megalo cannon math.

    Pokemon: 14

    3 Genesect EX
    3 Virizion EX
    1 Lugia EX
    1 Deoxys EX
    3 Drifloon PLB
    2 Drifblim PLB
    1 Drifblim DRX

    Trainers/Supporters: 32

    4 Professor Juniper
    4 N
    3 Skyla
    2 Colress
    1 Shadow Triad

    3 Colress Machine
    3 Pokemon Catcher
    4 Ultra Ball
    2 Super Rod
    4 Float Stone
    1 Switch
    1 G-Booster - Ace Spec

    Energy: 14

    3 Plasma Energy
    11 Grass Energy
  18. PellOfTheTundra

    PellOfTheTundra Do you even LT-87

    I'm not sure this is a good enough reason to not run Skyarrow; Garbodor is a thing, without a counterstadium, you can still get laserbank'd.

    Please elaborate on why no stadium.
  19. Brochacho01

    Brochacho01 Not even caring

    My reason for no stadium is I want free retreat, go to watch this battle which is what my deck is based off of and you will see.

  20. infernaperocks

    infernaperocks A Proud Member Of Team Rouge!

    from my testing with lugia (which has been going on for about a month and a half now) it rarely is used and often times just wastes energy and space.
    yoyos and JR_nathan like this.