Wild Blaze [JPN] // Flashfire [ENG]

Discussion in 'Pokemon TCG News & Gossip' started by Vablakes, Dec 12, 2013.

  1. Otaku

    Otaku Well-Known Member

    It isn't?

    Honest question; sitting on the sidelines here... and remember my question doesn't mean that Garbotoxin decks aren't an issue for Ability focused decks, but can also mean that some pieces of the combo are being left out.
  2. StormFront

    StormFront Active Member

    In the past Catcher was enough to deal Garbodor, but it got problematic when Float Stone came out. There is Pokémon who can discard tools which is what I was referring to, and we'll be getting Trevenant which will throw another spanner in the works. However, I do think Garbodor is a bad card for the game (I thought the same of Muk FS as well), especially given the way the format has evolved. Decks which are least hurt by it (Genesect/Virizion), unsurprisingly are doing the best right now.
  3. InfinityMinusOne

    InfinityMinusOne Has a tendency to exist

    To be perfectly honest, Tool Scrapper is better than literally any and every splashable Pokemon that has anything to do with discarding or locking out Tool cards. Looking through Pkmncards.com, there is the obvious Chatot PLB, and there is also everything else that discards Tools, either solely from the active (i.e. Bouffalant PLS, Skarmory EX, and about a dozen evolutions) or the one-time use Stage 2 (Salamence PLB), all of which not only require more resources to use (including deck space), but also require you to sacrifice a turn of attacking. I'd consider Tool Scrapper to be the best option in a heartbeat without a doubt, seeing as it uses minimal deck space, can be played at any time during your turn, and can also disced Tools that exist on any position on your opponent's board. Admittedly, Trevenant and Gothitelle can lock out Tools, but those are very specialized cards that do/will only work in decks that revolve around them and can't really be considered in the list of all-around counters to Garbodor.

    Of course, maybe I'm just not thinking outside the box enough. What would be a specific list of Garbodor counters that you have in mind that are better than the "meh" Tool Scrapper? More specifically, what makes Tool Scrapper a mediocre counter by comparison?
  4. Otaku

    Otaku Well-Known Member


    Thanks, but I am still not understanding. @InfinityMinusOne basically brings up the questions I would ask. As the ignorant (so again, I am waiting for someone to set me straight on this) again just sort of poking his head in to try and get a vague idea of the format, I don't see how this is an issue; if you rely on Abilities, you should also be relying on Tool Scrapper. Not a single copy of it nor a double, but at least three and maybe even four. If you can't fit that in without cutting a counter for something else that is big, its more a flaw with the overall game design.

    Garbodor isn't all that powerful or good; no I am not ignoring the stellar performance of Garbodor decks but am trying to call attention to its partners... where would it be without "big Basic" Pokémon or the current crop of Trainers? StormFront mentioned Fossil Muk, which was in a similar boat except needing less resources (no "trigger card" required) and with even better draw and search power (though Energy Removal, Super Energy Removal, and Gust of Wind were also a major factor).

    Still, Fossil Muk as I remember it or was able to later research it, was kind of a Tier 3 deck. Trying to use the board definitions for Tiers here... but basically Haymaker and Haymaker variants were tops. Then came Rain Dance or similar "set-up" decks. Then came counter decks like Muk that usually were half Haymaker or set-up deck. Yes I am counting something like Wigglytuff from Jungle as "set-up" owing to how hard it was to use a Stage 1 Pokémon that required three Energy at this time. Even some of the earlier differences I mentioned are hard to judge: Pokémon Catcher is now Pokémon Reversal instead of Gust of Wind, we have Crushing Hammer and Enhanced Hammer instead of Energy Removal and Super Energy Removal... but several rules are different (not just first turn) and while the HP scores are much higher now, back then there wasn't an equivalent to Pokémon-EX and even with lower HP scores damage is relatively higher.

    TL;DR: @_@. Just... @_@
  5. Hydr8

    Hydr8 Diggersby tho

  6. ShinySephiroth

    ShinySephiroth There is Only One True Path

    Thanks! I saw the new name on Bubapedia and was trying to find the source. ^_^
  7. Hydr8

    Hydr8 Diggersby tho

    No probs, I posted it on Virbank City earlier and some people thought it was fake. I think it's a cool set name. The EX's will probably be pretty bad though, unless Mega Charizard is somehow good.
    ShinySephiroth likes this.
  8. PellOfTheTundra

    PellOfTheTundra Do you even LT-87

    If there's Mega Acceleration, then M Charizard-EX COULD be good.

    Also, there HAS to be more than just Charizard xD

    inb4 I am wrong and every card in the set is Charizard.
  9. SoldiersSpirit

    SoldiersSpirit I will defend my Kingdom.

    I'd love for every card to be charizard related lmao. Flareon EX would be too cool.
  10. PellOfTheTundra

    PellOfTheTundra Do you even LT-87

    What if Charizard were in the art for every card? Makes it a living hell for Charizard collectors, but everyone else...
    As for Eeveeloution-EXes, I don't know about that in this set. Obviously, there will be 2 M Charizard-EX, as well as at least 1 Charizard-EX. Adding a second Fire might not be a great idea.

    Possibly adding another Fairy EX and a Psychic EX could round out the set. Nothing weak to each other, nothing conflicting with the set's main focus-- Charizard.
    ShinySephiroth and StrongRhino like this.
  11. SoldiersSpirit

    SoldiersSpirit I will defend my Kingdom.

    I was just talking about Fire type EX's lmao
  12. Salamencetrainer34

    Salamencetrainer34 An ogre-achiever

    Team flare is going to be involved in this set. Fire? Doom? Personally, I would LOVE a red card border like how team plasmas was blue.
    ShinySephiroth and StrongRhino like this.
  13. PellOfTheTundra

    PellOfTheTundra Do you even LT-87

    Or, maybe a flaming inner border... Like, flames that go into the yellow?
    ShinySephiroth likes this.
  14. Hydr8

    Hydr8 Diggersby tho

    Maybe they will do a red border if they release some Flare sets
  15. baby_mario

    baby_mario Doesn't even care

    For such an iconic Pokemon, Charizard has such an awful history in the TCG.

    No, Base Set wasn't playable - it was rubbish. People only think otherwise because back in the day there were a lot of casual players using even worse cards, so you could win a few games against your mates with it. Competitively, it was pants.

    Charizard δ CG and Charizard AR were vaguely playable. So was Charizard G, I guess.

    But they have never gived him a top tier card. Probably not even a second tier one.
  16. PellOfTheTundra

    PellOfTheTundra Do you even LT-87

    I'm gonna go out on a limb and say his luck isn't going to improve.

    Nothing to back this up, just a gut feeling.
  17. StormFront

    StormFront Active Member

    No doubt this set will force players to fork out hundreds of dollars on a new cards before Nationals. Like they've done for the previous two years.
  18. Salamencetrainer34

    Salamencetrainer34 An ogre-achiever

    [spoiler][​IMG] [​IMG] [/spoiler] New images of pack art!
    Gelato, StrongRhino and MaverickNate like this.
  19. PellOfTheTundra

    PellOfTheTundra Do you even LT-87


    Please help me, I think I am going to die.
  20. Gelatin

    Gelatin So soft and jiggly.

    Inb4 it's not worth the turn spent m-evolving.